r37 Posted January 28, 2014 Posted January 28, 2014 Right, advice time please: Rather than go the tried, tested and proven route of supercharging i want to go for a revvy N/A build. What i'd like is some advise. I'll be keeping the budget to a bare minimum on this and my car is daily driven so needs to be off the road for as little time as possible. The things im after doing are : - Headwork (port + polish, gas flowed) - Cams changed - New springs + retainers - Maybe new valves if i decide to go +1mm or the valve seats need re-grinding - New pistons - New con rods - re-use stock crank but have it edged and lightened. - All of the other stuff (head bolds, bearings, intake ect) The stuff like the pistons/rods will need to be done in a shop as i cant come close to changing them. But what i can do is build the heads and then have them bolted straight in. Is it worth doing this to save the time/money of having them rebuilt or is it more hastle than its worth to do if i mess something up and send a valve spring through the rocker cover. Ive budgeted around 6k for the entire thing. Parts are around £4k and labour is around £2k based on info gathered from the internet. The other option is to get a blown engine and then have it built professionally and then swapped back into my existing car. This would help with the downtime of the car and might halp recoup some of the costs as my current engine is a fairly low mileage one. I should probobly speak to horsham / abbey at some point but would like to tap the wealth of knowlege here first. Quote
ZMANALEX Posted January 28, 2014 Posted January 28, 2014 What are you trying to achieve here ? Alex. Quote
andy james Posted January 28, 2014 Posted January 28, 2014 You would be lucky to get 350 rwhp with all that effort and cash. If you still want a revvy motor with big power then Super charging is the way forward. If you have a DE or rev up engine then your budget will give you great results. Take at Kyser,octet,Darren,Sam,gt4zed,etc to see what they have done. Good luck. Quote
350 Russ Posted January 28, 2014 Posted January 28, 2014 honestly your going to spend a fortune for not that much gain, if you want it a bit more revvy and more hp i would personally suggest supercharged and a lightweight flywheel. Quote
r37 Posted January 28, 2014 Author Posted January 28, 2014 380 rwhp is easily achievable, not much behind a low boosted supercharger. Plus i dont want to supercharge, everyone supercharges. I want to do something different. 1 Quote
KyleR Posted January 28, 2014 Posted January 28, 2014 NA build would be interesting and I'd love to do it myself if I had the money, despite pound for pound the S/C making better gains. Good luck mate Quote
Neilp Posted January 28, 2014 Posted January 28, 2014 Ur dreaming if you think you're gonna make 380whp. There was a car with a fully built forged high compression engine that abbey done for sale on here and it made 310whp. Good luck but I think you should be more realistic. To get that power your gonna be 10k+ in parts and labour. Engine building is not the same as mechanics. It's the same as a plumber is to a heating engineer. Two completely different specialities. 1 Quote
Lexx Posted January 28, 2014 Posted January 28, 2014 There are a few members who have went for power through the NA route. All of them have given up after spending a small fortune and not getting anywhere near the gains they expected. You say you want to keep the budget to a bare minimum......a minimum for what? What power/torque figures do you want to achieve? £6k is nowhere near enough to get 380 at the hubs. Christ, if that was the case people wouldn't spend £7-8k on superchargers. I'm sure someone here has a built NA engine and managed 340hp at the fly after spending a small fortune actually. Think it may have been for sale. Quote
Ian Posted January 28, 2014 Posted January 28, 2014 380 rwhp is easily achievable, not much behind a low boosted supercharger. Plus i dont want to supercharge, everyone supercharges. I want to do something different. 1 Quote
Ricey Posted January 28, 2014 Posted January 28, 2014 10 of the ebay piggyback chips linked together maybe? Quote
Adrian@TORQEN Posted January 29, 2014 Posted January 29, 2014 (edited) I know is not very helpful, but that's the best I could come up now Edited January 29, 2014 by octet Quote
MrLizard Posted January 29, 2014 Posted January 29, 2014 380whp would be hard to acheive from an NA build on a budget, i think you would really have to spend quite a bit of money and do a lot of work on the intake and headers... ive looked into this countless times and although something is occurring now id be happy with 380 at the fly Quote
GT4 Zed Posted January 29, 2014 Posted January 29, 2014 (edited) As said already you cannot achieve 380whp on a budget. It's plausibly achievable if you can do all the labour and get parts on the cheap brand new or used on a place like my350z.com but it will be a tall order. RJN Nissan (UK), Fontana Nissan (US) and SGP(Can) and 1 chap on my350 all have built NA cars with close and about 350-400whp but at great cost. Secondly of all that lot I'd only trust the result and reliability from RJN and Fontana. They both used 3.8l cosworth stroker kits, high compression to exploit race fuel, dry sump lubrication and serious head work with lightweight titanium valvetrain parts LTH and tuned exhaust amongst order things.. If you are doing a NA car for drifting or trackday only stick with the usual bolt-ons, Uprev and strip it as light as you can and save you money otherwise. Good luck if you do it. Edited January 29, 2014 by GT4 Zed 1 Quote
r37 Posted January 30, 2014 Author Posted January 30, 2014 thanks for the feedback but im still looking at a revvy N/A build. I like to against the grain and do something different and N/A is just the ticket. Might look into a very low boost supercharger with some headwork/ect. try and get the most out of the motor i can before going FI. Quote
Clarkie Posted January 30, 2014 Posted January 30, 2014 s/c is cheaper. I upgraded, exhaust, plenum, cats, uprev, intake and only saw less than stock power... for the same cost I got a supercharger. needless to say I saw a little more than stock power for the same style of power delivery (linear) If you wanna get some nice figures do It properly and FI the zed. Quote
Lexx Posted January 30, 2014 Posted January 30, 2014 thanks for the feedback but im still looking at a revvy N/A build. I like to against the grain and do something different and N/A is just the ticket. Might look into a very low boost supercharger with some headwork/ect. try and get the most out of the motor i can before going FI. We're all for doing something different. That wasn't what we were saying. We were saying your goals were unrealistic. Quote
Darren-B Posted January 30, 2014 Posted January 30, 2014 To get a Revvy VQ, SC it & get the lightest flywheel/clutch combo you can find accompanied with a decent throttle map with the UPREV software. Quote
Jez @ H-Dev Posted January 30, 2014 Posted January 30, 2014 I'd really like to do a decent NA build - but as the others have said, it'll be expensive and you won't get as much power as if you go FI. Quote
HARMLU Posted January 30, 2014 Posted January 30, 2014 Fair play, I get the going against the grain bit. But seriously look at the power/torque you want to achieve and how you are going to do that. You will be spending big bucks on building the engine. If you are going to do it, build the engine AND supercharge/turbo charge it if budget permits. There's a reason why there is 'a grain' in this case. Quote
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