Db limits

[Jetpilot]

Lets have a chat, not thats anything we can do, but i am growing increasingly frustrated with draconian db limits. Yes of course i understand residents dont want v8's, v10's or v12's on open pipes, any car come to think about it, but i did Goodwood yesterday and on the booking the same as any other track info, you will be required to meet a static drive by of "x", passed no problem, no mention of passing drive bys (although we know they exist), but there is no standard we can all work too, microphones can be placed anywhere at any distance from the track.

 

So as an example yesterday, my mate went in his Atom, 98db static (thats on the limit) but didnt trip one noise meter, i was 95db and tripped 2 out of the 3 first time out, yet i can drive at Combe with no issue as an example.

 

The big irony to me yesterday was during our time there, helicopters and planes were taking off and landing all day, you can be damn sure they were louder than anything out on track.

 

So should there not be a standardised test that is enforced and acceptable at each circuit or to play devils advocate, should it be relevant to each circuit and its circumstance and geography?

[Stutopia]

If I was being cyclical I'd say the big business involved with planes and choppers are much more likely to able to pay the "fees" to influential local bodies/people to be allowed to make noise than most racing circuits. I also blame busybodies moving to these places where racing's been going on for years and trying to overwrite the motorsport history in the name of a boost in house prices.

 

I can't figure out why we haven't managed to come up with a noise cancelling technological solution already. Best of both worlds.

[Jetpilot]

Good points Stu, especially the noise cancelling technology

 

But Goodwood, i mean, the revenue they bring is mind blowing, apparently just to the local area its £25 million+ just for the festival of speed, £105 million nationally for that and the revival, i have to be honest, if i was Lord March i would just tell the "few" nimbies to f*ck off and try closing me down, i think the government would soon be on his side!

[GMballistic]

I signed a petition years ago and wrote a letter to the local council at Castle Combe after they started getting noise complaints. Basically some rich barstewards who had moved into the area started to kick up a fuss because the circuit was too noisy for their liking.

 

I mean it takes the piddle especially as these people are well aware that the circuit exists when they move to the area (it was first opened in the 1950's so well established).

 

It's people like that which cause problems for racing circuits unfortunately leading to stricter and stricter rules/regulations regarding noise pollution.

 

Oh and regarding running a Zed at Combe, ...my supercharged Zed running De-Cats passed the static Db test but then they pulled me up later as I failed on drive by noise tests passed the pit lane. Luckily I had already done as much track time as I'd wanted to by then that day.

[350_Jer]

Thruxton on a Motorsport Events trackday is a 90db static limit!

[Jetpilot]

I managed to do Thruxton with my fi'd 350 without issue, however, I was noise boarded at Bedford, with the same car, so consider that place far worse.

Edited September 18, 2016 by Jetpilot

[Fodder]

I have no experience in this at all but here's my view anyway . It's where there is no hard legislation but lots of ambiguous rules you're going to get the odd jobs worth who just wants to stamp their authority. It happens in all industries so I think you are correct, make a standard set of rules with impartial enforcement that way everyone knows what they are working with.

 

Easier said than done I know.

Edited September 18, 2016 by Fodder

[Ekona]

Personally, I consider it the responsibility of every track day goer to make their car as quiet as possible before hitting the track. If we don't give the NIMBYs the ammo, then ultimately we win.

 

Besides, you can't hear anything properly with a helmet on anyway, so no point having the nicest sounding car.

[Jetpilot]

I didnt expect you to say anything other than the contrary but its not just trackdays, motorsports events are also obliged to meet certain db limits, what was the biggest complaint surrouding F1 over the last few years, noise or lack of.

 

A guy in a totally std 911 gts struggled with the static on Saturday and had spiked 1 of the trackside mics, so its not just aftermarket "noisey" boys.

 

Going back to my first post, i dont disagree there shouldnt be db limits, but surely there should at least be a standardised format for testing that is reasonable and universal in its testing at all circuits and subsequent monitoring at the nimbys homes which also needs to meet certain criteria before complaints can be upheld, as reference I can drive round Combe all day without issue, not even borderline at Goodwood, as Gm says, if you choose to move near a motorsport venue, you have to expect noise of cars going round a circuit.

Edited September 19, 2016 by Jetpilot

[Ekona]

A guy in a totally std 911 gts struggled with the static on Saturday and had spiked 1 of the trackside mics, so its not just aftermarket "noisey" boys.

Indeed, this has been an issue going back to the 997.2 GT3. The trouble is that it's only the UK that suffers from this problem, so it's hard to justify commercially to produce a new exhaust when the cars are sold out multiple times over anyway!

 

The law for nuisance noise is a double edged sword, as whilst it protects a great many things unfortunately it does seem to discriminate unfairly against motorsport. When I become Grand Master Overlord Of The Universe, I'll build f*ck-off great big walls around every track and then the NIMBYs can get stuffed.

[brillomaster]

I think the F1 argument isn't really necessary... the cars sound crap cos no one wants a hybrid electric EKERS D-UMP C-RUD 1.6litre turbocharged V6 'power unit', we want a naturally aspirated V10 or V12, that revs to 18,000rpm.

 

anywhos, while I agree that nimbys moving next to a track and then complaining about the noise is idiotic, its very unlikely to change, so i'd rather people just sorted their silencing out before they attempted to go on track. and if you cant sort your silencing for the quieter souther circuits, you'll have to travel further north! most MSV tracks are 102 - 105 Db static, and rockingham run a few unsilenced days.

 

Personally if I knew I was likely to visit goodwood, castle combe, thruxton etc. the first thing id do before upgrading anything else on a car is check that it comfortably meets noise regs.

[BobbyZ]

i dont disagree there shouldnt be db limits

 

Now I know that grammar nazis aren't the most popular people on the internet these days, but I'll be damned if that's not a triple negative

[StevoD]

If I was being cyclical I'd say the big business involved with planes and choppers are much more likely to able to pay the "fees" to influential local bodies/people to be allowed to make noise than most racing circuits. I also blame busybodies moving to these places where racing's been going on for years and trying to overwrite the motorsport history in the name of a boost in house prices.

 

I can't figure out why we haven't managed to come up with a noise cancelling technological solution already. Best of both worlds.

 

i spent some time in southern poland last week and was amazed that going through the city was a motorway with this massive wall each side to stop the noise, yes its ugly but cant have everything, i also suspect most tracks dont have the budget for it though

 

[Ekona]

And there was me thinking that it was the Germans that liked their big walls.

[StevoD]

And there was me thinking that it was the Germans that liked their big walls.

 

well i was in old east german lol

[Stutopia]

I really meant something a bit less invasive, like the opposing waves they use in noise cancelling you get on headphones, but you know, BIGGER.

[modo]

PARDON

[Rock_Steady]

Personally, I consider it the responsibility of every track day goer to make their car as quiet as possible before hitting the track. If we don't give the NIMBYs the ammo, then ultimately we win.

 

Besides, you can't hear anything properly with a helmet on anyway, so no point having the nicest sounding car.

Do you wear a helmet on your way to work per chance? Or on a weekend B-road blast?

[Ekona]

I'm talking about track use, not road use.

 

Bungs & cats always in on track.

Edited September 19, 2016 by Ekona

[StevoD]

I'm talking about track use, not road use.

 

Bungs & decats always in on track.

 

do you mean cats always in

[Ekona]

I did, good spot.

[Jetpilot]

the first thing id do before upgrading anything else on a car is check that it comfortably meets noise regs.

 

But you cant check until your out there, there are too many variables, wind direction, positioning of mics, distance from track, i knew i would be close for the static so did everything i could bar design and build a new exhaust and managed to loose 3db from my Combe reading, at that point its cost you "x" to find out. The trouble is they dont even mention drive bys, all they say is (as i know you are aware), your car must meet the noise requirements of the track which are, static test performed at half and meter at 45 degrees at whatever decibel reading.

 

Its just all very ambiguous, i have no idea why there isnt a lets say, an industry std, so we can all get our cars sorted and surely it would just make it easier for everyone concerned, tracks, organisers, even the complaining nimbys.

[Ekona]

It's usually very obvious if a car is too loud for track or not, even without a noise meter.

 

Drive by meters are a pain though, I hate those too. I'd like to see them clearly painted so you know exactly where to lift, rather than guess.

[Jetpilot]

Its not loud but its not quiet either.

 

I did spend two laps with my mate finding the three as of course they wont tell you were they are and 2 out of three are corner exits were normally you would be on the gas.

 

I managed to drive round them, got over the wrong side of the track so to speak and waited till past but obviously its not quite the same experience, such a shame as the track is genuinely ace and quick too, the final corner and straight are brilliant.

[djtimo]

Personally, I consider it the responsibility of every track day goer to make their car as quiet as possible before hitting the track. If we don't give the NIMBYs the ammo, then ultimately we win.

 

Besides, you can't hear anything properly with a helmet on anyway, so no point having the nicest sounding car.

Personally, I consider it the responsibility of every track day goer to make their car as quiet as possible before hitting the track. If we don't give the NIMBYs the ammo, then ultimately we win.

 

Besides, you can't hear anything properly with a helmet on anyway, so no point having the nicest sounding car.

 

Sorry i don't agree at all.. Motorsport is just as much about the noise and feel as it is the performance for me.. I love doing unsilnced days as the car "feels" better from the driver seat to me. I also really enjoy hearing the car (my car is loud at 107/108db static and louder on driver by) so you can hear it well through the helmut.

 

days where I have to run extra silencers aren't as fun imho..