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cob1980

Advice please on 'faulty' out of warranty purchase

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This will probably split opinions... which is fine, I'm just after advice on what people would do in this situation. I'm not naming anyone here as this is on-going and I feel would be unfair at this point.

 

Last year during a sale I purchased a pair of relatively expensive HFC's made by a supposedly quality manufacturer and from a well known retailer. I wasn't ready to fit them at the time as I wanted to install when I was ready for a re-map. A few weeks ago I had them fitted. Sadly one of the HFC's did not fit well and after a couple of hours of tweaking by the mechanic it sat just mm from the underside of my Z. The other side by comparison sat very comfortably. I took my Z home in the hope that the gap was sufficient. A few miles in and it was very clear that it was not OK, I guess with the heat it had moved a bit and was rubbing against the underside. I carefully drove it the remainder of the distance home since the garage was closing when I left and home wasn't too far away.

 

I contacted the retailer to arrange an exchange for the faulty HFC. They said it was out of warranty now, and to try contacting the manufacturer which I did. The manufacturer said their policy is not to replace anything out of warranty but proceeded to ask questions anyway. All went quiet. I spoke to the retailer again and asked them if they could speak to the manufacturer themselves as I felt it was more likely they would listen to them. The manufacturer contacted me again to ask for further information.

 

All has gone quiet again, it's been nearly 3 weeks since this happened and about a week since I last heard anything. The latest I heard from the retailer is that the manufacturer is deciding what to do, but they had noted from my photos the HFC looked used -  which indeed they are because I made a half hour journey home.

 

I now feel completely stuck. I have a Z in my garage which I can't use in it's current state, which annoying me 'cos I don't get to use it much anyway. A retailer who can't help me. And a manufacturer who have said they'll "think about it". I've resisted sending a Section 75 letter at this point as I'd hoped the retailer/manufacturer would have done what I think is the correct thing to do and replace it with one that fits. Also, I don't want to p*ss off the retailer as I don't want to burn bridges.  That said, I'm not best pleased about this situation, regardless of when I fitted them, the one doesn't fit end of - it's not fit for purpose. How long am I expected to wait? Or are they just hoping I will go away!

 

My other option is (at my expense) have the HFC cut and re-welded to fit. It would be my luck at this point that the manufacturer would say they will replace it! I really want them fitted but I'm not keen on having them chopped up. Thoughts / advice please....?

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I'm not entirely sure, but hopefully someone will be along thats had a similar experience with resolve. 

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Given it's out of warranty and you've now used the item, I wouldn't expect the retailer to overly involved from this point.

 

The manufaturer might replace but again seeing as you fitted the item, saw it didn't fit properly and then proceeded to use it anyway rather than swapping it back out before using it, I wouldn't be overly surprised if they refused to be honest and you're now relying on them acting in good faith, IMO.

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Have to agree with the others - I'm not sure you'll have much of a chance getting a replacement / money back, unfortunately. 

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For the hassle it will cause to post the faulty cat back to America (presumably) and the cost it probably will incur to do so I would just find a decent welder, should only cost £30-50 to fix as you said.

It’s annoying, yes and I expect I will come across the same situation as I horde parts and don’t fit them but sadly that’s what happens as oem parts are built with machines and aftermarket are normally hand made in small batches.

 

just make sure your welder is decent if you don’t have good flexi joints or the oem bracket holding the cats 

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Also if it was me I would post the part in question so others know to check those parts when they buy them as quality control might not be up to par. And might save someone else a big bill for broken parts.

Looking at you whiteline and your diff bushes install instructions! :-p

 

As for the trader I would leave them out as they haven’t done anything wrong.

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Ummm, this is one of those cases when I should keep quiet and move on, but Adrian being Adrian, that's not going to happen, right? :) 


A few details to shade some light on the topic:
 

Trader: TORQEN
Manufacturer: ARK Performance
Product: 350z DE Stainless Steel R-Spec High Flow Cats, Polished

Purchase date: 27/03/2018 

Shipped to the customer: 11/04/2018
First contact from the OP: 09/07/2019 via Chat, 19/07 by phone and email.

As the product is out of the 12 months warranty, I emailed ARK Performance on 19th with the following text:


"While I understand the customer hasn’t fit the ARK HFCs - HC1100-0030 for over a year and it’s an exceptional situation with the product being out of warranty, as this is a fitment issue, could I please ask for gesture of good will from you guys and help the customer organising a replacement for him? It would be a shame with him going all over the forums and social media spreading photos with such a bad fitment for an ARK Performance product. 

Thanks a lot!"


I then informed the OP on the same day:

"I’ve emailed Michael and look forward to hearing from him. As soon as I have an update I will let you know here."

 

Reply received from ARK Performance on 20/07/2019:

"Hi Adrian, 

I wish I could help your customer, but there are a few issues that I am seeing. Our company return policy and warranty is as follows: 

https://arkperformance.com/index.php?route=information/information&information_id=10

Two things that we are dealing with, first it's been well over a year since the customer has purchased the item. Second, it is clearly visible the customer has been using the HFC (see photo attached from customer, you will notice the color change on the hfc) and now claims that there are issues. I will discuss the customers situation with the owner of ARK when he returns from his business trip at the end of this month, but with the facts that I have at this moment it is does not look very promising for a return. "

 

To which I replied:

"Hi Michael,

Appreciate your help, please let me know what the owner says, I know it’s an odd one, but trust we can keep the customer happy considering it’s a manufacturing defect. Look forward to hearing from you. Thanks again for your time!"

 

Follow-up email received from OP:

"Just seeing if you'd heard anything from ARK Performance? They'd asked what year my Z was last Friday."

 

My reply to OP:

"They’re saying they’re waiting from the owner of the company for a decision. They also said the pipes have been used, as they look burnt..."

 

A follow-up email sent to ARK Performance on 25/07/2019:

"On the “it is clearly visible the customer has been using the HFCs” bit, this is what the customer had to say:

“Yes, used all of about 30mins use which was me driving home. Rich adjusted it as best as he could, he thought it may have been OK as there was a couple of mm clearance but after a couple of miles I guess with the heat they had moved. The sound was horrendous so I'm not looking forward to getting it back to RPM and I hope it hasn't caused any damage to the underneath. I'm sure you believe me but if not Rich will tell you as he took them new out the box.” Rich is the mechanic that has installed the HFCs, specialised in Japanese cars. "

 

and follow up sent to the OP:

"I forwarded that to ARK and still wait to hear from them. As I said in the beginning, if they haven’t helped you as a customer, I doubt they’ll do anything for us. I don’t want to pester them too much on the subject as you can imagine."

 

Last email in the case, received from OP:

"Thanks Adrian. Yes that's OK, hopefully they'll just give me a yes/no answer soon so I know what I am doing and can get it sorted one way or another. Im booked in for the jap indoor show next month so need to have a solution brfore then, don't really want to take time off work to get the standard cats put back on if they decide they will replace it."

 

I've tried my best, ARK hasn't said NO yet, they're waiting for the owner to return, we're only a few days since my last email to them.

OP, feel free to send "Section 75 letter". Trader pi**ed, matter closed. :lol: 

 

 

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@Adrian@TORQEN ha, you could have kept quiet this was nothing bad about you.

 

You've put far more information here than you have said direct to me, it would have helped. You didn't mention end of the month, at least that gives me a date now. It's not just a simple case of getting them swapped out. It means getting car booked in possibly twice, taking time off work etc And I between now at the jap show I have a holiday booked. I didn't want to do the wrong thing as its seems I have already. Silly me shouldn't have expected them to fit :lol:

Edited by cob1980
Typo

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Seems a very clear and precise communication chain from Torqen. 

 

Ive never bought from Torqen but that is a very high standard of customer service, considering 15 months has passed. 

 

I think threads like these should be kept offline until a conclusion has been reached, good or bad. 

 

 

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Whilst I appreciate that Adrian is only trying to help (and credit for doing more than most traders would in this situation) I can’t help but feel that rather than having two separate conversations it would have been better just to include all parties in all (relevant) communications - that alone could have avoided this entire thread.

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Hmm tricky, really unfortunate situation to be in.

@cob1980 I totally feel for you, with any high end parts I'd also expect them to fit without any issues. Buying parts in advance because they're on sale is something I've done in the past too but storing them past the warranty expiry date is the risk you take I guess. 

 

It sounds like Adrian has done as much to help you as he can and the ball is out of his court now, hopefully Ark will sort this out for you as a gesture of good will but due to the fact they're now used I doubt it. 

 

I totally understand where you're coming from in the fact they've only been on for 30 mins and your mechanic thought they'd be alright but if there were fitment issues ideally you should have taken photos, refitted the old cats and contacted Ark. 

Sure this is a ballache because you've wasted your time, but from Ark's perspective now they only have your word to prove they've only been on the car for 1 day not 14 months. 

 

If they decide not to do anything about it I guess your options are to cut & re-weld them so they fit properly or sell them on and buy some alternate ones. 

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The Sale of Goods Act offers protection against faulty goods even when the manufacturer's guarantee has run out. The act says goods must last a reasonable time - and that can be anything up to six years from the date of purchase.

 

1. Contact the retailer

2. Get an independent report

3. Commission a repair: Ask the retailer to repair or replace the goods. If the repair cost is disproportionate the retailer can offer a refund of the original purchase price, though probably not a full refund. If the shop makes life difficult you can ask go to an independent repairer and reclaim the whole cost. Make sure they provide evidence of the fault.

 

https://www.theguardian.com/money/2006/mar/25/consumernews.howtocomplain

 

Faulty goods replaced or repaired

You have the right to get faulty goods replaced or repaired if it's too late to reject them. You can state your preference, but the retailer can normally choose to do whatever would be cheapest.

Under the Sale of Goods Act, the retailer must either repair or replace faulty goods 'within a reasonable time but without causing significant inconvenience'.

If the seller doesn't do this, you're entitled to claim either:

• a reduction on the purchase price, or
• your money back, minus an amount for the usage you've had of the goods (called recision).

If the retailer refuses to repair the goods, and won't replace them either, you may have the right to arrange for someone else to repair your item, and then claim compensation from the retailer for the cost of doing this.

 

You have six years to take a claim to court for faulty goods in England, Wales and Northern Ireland; in Scotland you have five years.

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SOGA hasn’t existed since 2015, so that’s all nonsense. It’s the Consumer Rights Act now. 

 

Honestly, it’s time to move on and get it sorted at your own expense I’m afraid. Expensive lesson to learn, but you’ll never leave bits sitting around for over a year again :) 

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OK thanks for all your input guys, I think enough has been said here. 

 

Hopefully ARK will take an interest in their product regardless of time and use. If not then it's in for the chop and weld lol. 

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7 hours ago, Ekona said:

SOGA hasn’t existed since 2015, so that’s all nonsense. It’s the Consumer Rights Act now. 

 

Honestly, it’s time to move on and get it sorted at your own expense I’m afraid. Expensive lesson to learn, but you’ll never leave bits sitting around for over a year again :) 

That's good to know, the newer retailer to consumer process from my understanding is still the similar even after the manufacturers warranty period. Contact retailer, if need be submit independent report (in this case to prove the fault was present at the time of purchase) to request replacement, refund or repair. It's a shame fall out over hopefully a relatively small fix and a shame Iain has the hassle of remedying the faulty part himself. Clearly the fault was present at the time of purchase.

 

Ultimately if this threads helps others in similar situations then it's no bad thing.

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