coldel Posted January 14, 2017 Share Posted January 14, 2017 Just be aware with black box premiums, I could be wrong but how it works is that they charge you the full amount, then once the data shows your driving habits fit to the contractual arrangement you are reimbursed to the level stated on the original post. So you could still end up paying normal levels of insurance. Well thats what I read about it a couple of years ago, some companies might work differently. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Strudul Posted January 14, 2017 Share Posted January 14, 2017 Just be aware with black box premiums, I could be wrong but how it works is that they charge you the full amount, then once the data shows your driving habits fit to the contractual arrangement you are reimbursed to the level stated on the original post. So you could still end up paying normal levels of insurance. Well thats what I read about it a couple of years ago, some companies might work differently. I know that is (or used to be) true with others, including having to pay extra if you drove after 11pm etc, but that's not the case with Admiral. -The price you pay is what you pay, it won't change unless you go over the mileage limit significantly. -The blackbox is free and they install it for you. -There will be no change to your premium during the year (unless you go for plug-and-drive, at which point it can go down after 3 months, but only down, not up). -They won't void your insurance or penalise you for going over the speed limit. -There are only negative repercussions if you are in the bottom (5?) percent of drivers, at which point they give you a month to stop being such a shite driver. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stephanie Posted January 14, 2017 Author Share Posted January 14, 2017 (edited) Yeah Black box is a no go, basically downgrades the car to a 1.2. I would consider it if it was considerably cheaper but for the sake of a couple hundred, I'd rather pay a bit more than have the hassle of a black box. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Edited January 14, 2017 by Stephanie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Strudul Posted January 14, 2017 Share Posted January 14, 2017 Not saying you have to or should get a black box, but you shouldn't discredit it purely due to your own ignorance. Though at the end of the day, it's your money, if you want to waste it, go ahead. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ekona Posted January 14, 2017 Share Posted January 14, 2017 NO NO NO BLACK BOX EVER NO NO NO The more people that give in and have these, the more they'll become cheaper to manufacture and cheaper for the insurance companies to buy. Once they're everywhere, suddenly you'll struggle to find a policy without a black box available, and then suddenly you're tracked everywhere. I'm one of the least paranoid people going, but it should be fairly obvious that the government and police would find an easy source of revenue from being able to fine people on the spot the second the break the law. This can only ever end in that. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Strudul Posted January 14, 2017 Share Posted January 14, 2017 (edited) Bollocks. All it is is a gps + accelerometer with a sim card, they already cost bugger all to make. Could achieve the same function with a £5 phone. There is no chance they would ever use it to fine people on the spot as there would be a public uproar. What it can be used for is to prove innocence / guilt in case of an accident, similar to a dashcam - which you seem to support. In fact, if anything dash cams are the product getting cheaper and has a much greater chance of becoming a legal requirement with the negatives you are paranoid about. Edited January 14, 2017 by Strudul Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ekona Posted January 14, 2017 Share Posted January 14, 2017 If they can spin it by saying all money goes to the NHS and schools, you think the majority won't suck it up? We already seem to have accepted speed cameras as a necessary evil, do we not? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Strudul Posted January 14, 2017 Share Posted January 14, 2017 Doubt it. And no we (or at least I) do not. Speed cameras are stupid because most of the speed limits are practically arbitrary. An actual safe limit should be determined by car, driver and conditions (but that's not feasible to enforce). Plus most cameras are on straight stretches, which admittedly is the most likely place someone would break the limit, but it's also the least dangerous place for someone to be speeding. It's far more important people slow down for corners, so if you're going to put a camera anywhere, put it there. A system that penalises for tailgating - now that would be a good thing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Willsy1980 Posted January 14, 2017 Share Posted January 14, 2017 I'd say no to the black box on the grounds that it is a modification to the OEM spec and would put the price up Seriously though, one girl at work has one and she was limited to 4000 miles a year or it was an extra 300 quid. Im with Ekona on the paranoid side too, I will not be subject to even more big brother state than im already forced into. I'd rather pay 3 times what I do in insurance than be tracked and graded on how, when and where I drive. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Strudul Posted January 14, 2017 Share Posted January 14, 2017 (edited) I'd say no to the black box on the grounds that it is a modification to the OEM spec and would put the price up Seriously though, one girl at work has one and she was limited to 4000 miles a year or it was an extra 300 quid. Im with Ekona on the paranoid side too, I will not be subject to even more big brother state than im already forced into. I'd rather pay 3 times what I do in insurance than be tracked and graded on how, when and where I drive. I'm starting to sound like I have shares in Admiral or something, but there's just so much misinformation... With Admiral you choose your annual limit as you would normally (mines 10k) and it has no different impact than it would with a non-black box policy (there wasn't much difference in cost between 3k miles and 10k miles IIRC, we're talking tens of pounds). You make it sound like they are sat there watching your every move. Lets be realistic, that just ain't happening, it will all be calculated by computers. If you're planning on robbing a bank and using your car as a getaway vehicle, then you might want to avoid a black box, but if you aren't committing crimes* on a daily basis or intend to lie when filling out your details, then there is very little reason why you shouldn't get a black box. *Now, I wouldn't possibly break the speed limit, but my friend *cough* has a black box, drives in a... spirited... manner, not particularly worrying about adhering to speed limits, letting the car breathe while exiting roundabouts, and making sure to enjoy his car to the full when it's safe to do so, but regularly gets a gold / silver rating for his driving. As I say, you are only going to get penalised if you are in the very bottom % of drivers. So, think of the worst driver you know, who drives it like they stole it and thinks every road is a rally stage - do you drive like them every single day? If so: 1) You shouldn't be driving 2) Don't get a black box 3) Make sure your job doesn't require a car cos eventually you are going to get disqualified from driving Even if you score bronze on every journey, there's going to be plenty of worse drivers. You may not get a discount next year, but it probably won't go up either. It's a reward based system. The less of a risk you are, the more discount you will receive. If come renewal time they penalised people and increased their premiums, then everyone would just get insured with another company. TL;DR - Stop being paranoid and do your research. Edited January 14, 2017 by Strudul Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ilogikal1 Posted January 15, 2017 Share Posted January 15, 2017 You can hardly blame people for being a little sceptical, given how Admiral in particular historically go to whole new levels (an impressive achievement in the insurance industry!) to increase premiums to the benefit of their bottom line. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WINKJ Posted January 16, 2017 Share Posted January 16, 2017 Don't get the cheapest, get the one that covers you the best. I agree but when I was younger, so much younger, I had to go cheap. Although I couldn't afford a Zed at 21. I could hardly afford the clapped out Capri I had. Times were different then. Worked my bum off and been saving for a very long time to get my Zed 😠Every penny I have is money I've earned. Will probably go with Admiral, £1500 fully comp. not too bad considering I'm 21. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk I know we discuss this on the forum time and time again but I can't help but think that is extremely high. When I got my first Z, I was also 21, I never paid more than 850 with admiral or eleplant. Do you live in a city centre? Or anywhere near Luton Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WINKJ Posted January 16, 2017 Share Posted January 16, 2017 I'd say no to the black box on the grounds that it is a modification to the OEM spec and would put the price up Seriously though, one girl at work has one and she was limited to 4000 miles a year or it was an extra 300 quid. Im with Ekona on the paranoid side too, I will not be subject to even more big brother state than im already forced into. I'd rather pay 3 times what I do in insurance than be tracked and graded on how, when and where I drive. I'm starting to sound like I have shares in Admiral or something, but there's just so much misinformation... With Admiral you choose your annual limit as you would normally (mines 10k) and it has no different impact than it would with a non-black box policy (there wasn't much difference in cost between 3k miles and 10k miles IIRC, we're talking tens of pounds). You make it sound like they are sat there watching your every move. Lets be realistic, that just ain't happening, it will all be calculated by computers. If you're planning on robbing a bank and using your car as a getaway vehicle, then you might want to avoid a black box, but if you aren't committing crimes* on a daily basis or intend to lie when filling out your details, then there is very little reason why you shouldn't get a black box. *Now, I wouldn't possibly break the speed limit, but my friend *cough* has a black box, drives in a... spirited... manner, not particularly worrying about adhering to speed limits, letting the car breathe while exiting roundabouts, and making sure to enjoy his car to the full when it's safe to do so, but regularly gets a gold / silver rating for his driving. As I say, you are only going to get penalised if you are in the very bottom % of drivers. So, think of the worst driver you know, who drives it like they stole it and thinks every road is a rally stage - do you drive like them every single day? If so: 1) You shouldn't be driving 2) Don't get a black box 3) Make sure your job doesn't require a car cos eventually you are going to get disqualified from driving Even if you score bronze on every journey, there's going to be plenty of worse drivers. You may not get a discount next year, but it probably won't go up either. It's a reward based system. The less of a risk you are, the more discount you will receive. If come renewal time they penalised people and increased their premiums, then everyone would just get insured with another company. TL;DR - Stop being paranoid and do your research. Even if you were to rob a bank with a black box fitted I would be surprised if this is information the law could legally get their hands on. Would be interesting to read into what the black box data can be used for outside of its main purpose. I would think (which I'll confirm via my friend Google), that we as the policy holder would also be the data owner and the insurance company would just be a data processor and therefore not be allowed to give access to an external party without our concent. I digress Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coldel Posted January 16, 2017 Share Posted January 16, 2017 As Wink said its the fact they are data processors and data owners that makes the difference. There are very strict laws in place around data ownership, around who owns it and who processes it. Its also hugely in these companies interests to NOT give up the data to third parties. The only way that could happen is if you as an individual gave express permission for the data to be handed over to third parties when entering into the agreement. A good example was the iPhone CIA case recently where Apple would be (ironically) breaking the law to open up an iPhone to the CIA even in the instance of a terror attack. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ekona Posted January 16, 2017 Share Posted January 16, 2017 And anyone trusts the government to not change the law at their whim? Snooper's charter that was passed in November last year, anyone? If the data doesn't exist, they can't get their hands on it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coldel Posted January 16, 2017 Share Posted January 16, 2017 All that bill does is clarify powers that are already in place, media would have you think otherwise (there are two acts being drafted). Somewhat ironically part of the bill is that journalists communications with sources are protected under this bill, but hey they don't mention that in the press its much more fun to create paranoia around us all living in some sort of Enemy of the State scenario. At the moment its all grey about what can and cannot be accessed and you end up with court cases trying to unravel who can do what. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KyleR Posted January 16, 2017 Share Posted January 16, 2017 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stephanie Posted January 16, 2017 Author Share Posted January 16, 2017 Don't get the cheapest, get the one that covers you the best. I agree but when I was younger, so much younger, I had to go cheap. Although I couldn't afford a Zed at 21. I could hardly afford the clapped out Capri I had. Times were different then. Worked my bum off and been saving for a very long time to get my Zed 😠Every penny I have is money I've earned. Will probably go with Admiral, £1500 fully comp. not too bad considering I'm 21. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk I know we discuss this on the forum time and time again but I can't help but think that is extremely high. When I got my first Z, I was also 21, I never paid more than 850 with admiral or eleplant. Do you live in a city centre? Or anywhere near Luton Hmm premiums have probably increased, but that does seem a jump! Nope, I live in a village in leafy Surrey 😂 Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Olly350z Posted January 16, 2017 Share Posted January 16, 2017 The important question is, have you gotten it insured and enjoying it!? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stephanie Posted January 16, 2017 Author Share Posted January 16, 2017 The important question is, have you gotten it insured and enjoying it!? All in good time Olly, all in good time 🤓 In other words, will be starting it from 1st of next month, so when it comes to renewal in future years I will have been paid again after Christmas ready to fork out for the insurance and tax all in one go ðŸ‘🼠Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Willsy1980 Posted January 16, 2017 Share Posted January 16, 2017 The important question is, have you gotten it insured and enjoying it!? All in good time Olly, all in good time í ¾í´“ In other words, will be starting it from 1st of next month, so when it comes to renewal in future years I will have been paid again after Christmas ready to fork out for the insurance and tax all in one go í ½í±í ¼í¿¼ Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Just tax it for 6 months, then put 12 on it and move that cost to summer Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coldel Posted January 16, 2017 Share Posted January 16, 2017 Tax is monthly DD? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stephanie Posted January 16, 2017 Author Share Posted January 16, 2017 Willsy and Coldel, good ideal but I just like to pay everything off as much as humanly possible, so no need to worry about it again for a while. If I could pay 2 years upfront I probably would. I'm not about that monthly game Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Strudul Posted January 16, 2017 Share Posted January 16, 2017 It's also more expensive if you choose to pay monthly or biannually. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shaun350z Posted January 16, 2017 Share Posted January 16, 2017 TBH £1500 is pretty reasonable! When I insured my 350z at 22 it cost me £1500. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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