MikeyM Posted March 26, 2016 Share Posted March 26, 2016 Excuse if asked before but what's the Fundamental differences out of curiosity..if there is any? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-Bradders- Posted March 26, 2016 Share Posted March 26, 2016 Didnt know there was non licensed! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeyM Posted March 26, 2016 Author Share Posted March 26, 2016 Didnt know there was non licensed! Well, let me put it another way... a remap that doesn't have an Uprev licence basically.. The gains seem the same.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-Bradders- Posted March 26, 2016 Share Posted March 26, 2016 Didnt know there was non licensed! Well, let me put it another way... a remap that doesn't have an Uprev licence basically.. The gains seem the same.. Is that on a stock ecu i thought you couldnt get into the ecu without the uprev? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tricky-Ricky Posted March 26, 2016 Share Posted March 26, 2016 If you purchase the software you are still paying for a license to use. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
d95gas Posted March 26, 2016 Share Posted March 26, 2016 Just for info ..... Yes you can get into the ECU without the software. My son did one for a guy on here is based down in Taunton area ...... That said he has £1000's worth of diagnostic and mapping gear. He has also done a few ECU repairs where the throttle body butterfly has been moved whilst still powered up to the ECU. He gets to play with boys toys all day long Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kieran_ctr Posted March 26, 2016 Share Posted March 26, 2016 I wouldn't ever get a remap from a mobile company, I want a dyno/print out to see my gains & not go off there word! I've only heard of license remap on these from the big company's so my guess is they no what's best Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davey_83 Posted March 27, 2016 Share Posted March 27, 2016 Tbf a rolling road can be set up to show different figures from one run to the next. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fishfire Posted March 27, 2016 Share Posted March 27, 2016 (edited) Tbf a rolling road can be set up to show different figures from one run to the next. +1 All my previous cars have been live road mapped. A car which has been solely mapped on a dyno can be made to produce those figures on a dyno. ...whether that then translates to the same power on the road is an age old argument, as you cannot accurately reproduce actual road conditions on a dyno Edited March 27, 2016 by fishfire Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richf Posted March 28, 2016 Share Posted March 28, 2016 If you don't trust the mapper it would make no difference whether they use road or not Any mapper that doesn't use a dyno is an amateur imo and best avoided but each to their own 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeyM Posted March 28, 2016 Author Share Posted March 28, 2016 The company have a rolling road but are not licenced to do the uprev basically.. It's thier own map and they are jail breaking the ecu Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richf Posted March 28, 2016 Share Posted March 28, 2016 The company have a rolling road but are not licenced to do the uprev basically.. It's thier own map and they are jail breaking the ecu Uprev is just a software package , there are alternatives, most people just choose works for them Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeyM Posted March 28, 2016 Author Share Posted March 28, 2016 The company have a rolling road but are not licenced to do the uprev basically.. It's thier own map and they are jail breaking the ecu Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZMANALEX Posted March 28, 2016 Share Posted March 28, 2016 Litchfields have been tuning and mapping GTRs for many, many years and only recently installed a dyno. All there tuning and mapping before the dyno install was all live road. My present GT-R R35 has never seen a dyno and running circa 720 bhp courtesy of Ecutek My 350Z, now running Syvecs S6 plus and circa 666bhp will also be capable of remote mapping including populating tyre sizes to maximise traction control. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fake ben taylor Posted March 28, 2016 Share Posted March 28, 2016 RichI believe Jez started out mapping on the road.... So I wouldnt be so quick to shout cuch people down Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Floydbax Posted March 28, 2016 Share Posted March 28, 2016 The company have a rolling road but are not licenced to do the uprev basically.. It's thier own map and they are jail breaking the ecu I think you will find that UPRev is pretty much jailbreaking the ECU, they are not under license from Nissan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
d95gas Posted March 28, 2016 Share Posted March 28, 2016 A great deal of faith put on "Dyno's", and not always give the outcome expected or desired. Ryan (Syvecs) spent probably more time road mapping than he did on the dyno, in fact the majority of the time he only used the dyno for final tweaks......and his talent speaks for its self. I think Litchfields reputation speaks for itself, and as Alex stated, only recently installed a dyno I have also been on dyno days with a mixture of cars, where clearly the figures have been adjusted for "bragging rights", and of course to make the customer keep coming back. I think there is arguments for and against both, but as Rich said earlier....... each to their own. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fishfire Posted March 28, 2016 Share Posted March 28, 2016 If you don't trust the mapper it would make no difference whether they use road or not Any mapper that doesn't use a dyno is an amateur imo and best avoided but each to their own Simon (Jolly Green Monster) has a huge reputation in the Subaru world and feels much the same way about mappers who solely map on a dyno. Besides, I remember a certain guy called Jez from a place called Horsham Developments who once live road mapped my impreza.....without a dyno in sight. Made good numbers on Surrey Rolling Road the same day. I'm not a mapper by any stretch but but the argument is that the fuel/timing cells that get adjusted on a dyno are then 'out' when put on a real road due to things which cannot be recreated on a dyno, like cooling, drag, road resistance etc etc Like I said it's an age old argument and a big old can of worms, though a dyno is certainly a good tool. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tricky-Ricky Posted March 28, 2016 Share Posted March 28, 2016 Agreed! its not all about dyno mapping, IMO to get the best from a map it need both road and dyno, as both on their own will miss certain load areas, although having said that I have mapped all my cars on the road. FBT yes I can remember Jez and John was it? still trying to finish a map as they turned up for roiling road days on more than one occasion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richf Posted March 28, 2016 Share Posted March 28, 2016 RichI believe Jez started out mapping on the road.... So I wouldnt be so quick to shout cuch people down Yep Jez road mapped my Skyline, you wont get him doing it now though and he will be the first to admit its not ideal, taking a car around the block just to check it isnt road mapping and we still do that. Mapping cars like this on the road is sheer lunacy, think back to what happened to Tweenierob, you are advocating driving at well over 100mph with a total stranger who quite often has driving standards that leave a lot to be desired. Also Simon JGM is no longer with us either but where possible he would use a dyno as well. http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/essex/8312990.stm Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fishfire Posted March 28, 2016 Share Posted March 28, 2016 Had no idea that Simon had passed away! Great guy and brilliant mapper. Got my impreza close to the magic 400hp with his mapping skills. I'll agree that the speeds that you can get to whilst live mapping can get inappropriate and that you're totally in the hands of the guy driving....usually a stranger as you said, but it still makes sense to me that a car mapped on the road will make the power on the road, where as a car mapped solely on a dyno can make great figures on the dyno, but chances are it won't be the same power on the road. Much like training two athletes, one on the road and one on the tread mill. I know who'll be quicker in the real world Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris@Dyna.Tune Posted March 29, 2016 Share Posted March 29, 2016 It's also worth adding into the mix that not all dyno's are the same, some are a pure inertia dyno, some have retarders. Mapping on the road can have it's flaws too, what if you tune it on a nice flat straight and then the driver goes up a hill causing the ECU to hit load sites that weren't seen during tuning? As a dyno owner/operator/tuner I have seen the pro's and con's of dyno Vs Road tunes. As someone has said you can have everything set up sweet as a nut on the dyno and then hit the road and the boost can over shoot quite easily if not set right, that's why a road test is always advised after a dyno session. This is a bit difficult for track cars but that's why a lot of tuners will offer track side support to review the data from on-board loggers (where available). All of the hard work will have already been done, timing will be optimised, fuelling will be correct, it's just the real world behaviour of the turbo that can be an unknown, which is probably why some operators will hold it back slightly, making the car feel less responsive. When road tuning unless you have a huge wealth of experience and/or are dealing with a knock limited engine there is no way to know if you've truly got the timing right, this is where dyno's with retarders come into their own (and inertia dyno's fail), the ability to hold the engine at a set RPM point whilst the operator optimises the timing is a phenomenal tool. Back on topic, Uprev is just a software like ECUTEK, the owners are protecting their investment and recouping their costs by having a licence, this way they can continue to pay their staff to improve their products. The ability to remap the OEM ECU can be done using other tools but to edit the file you're best to know hexadecimal code to understand the data before making changes, I for one am not a software engineer which is why I pay for products like Uprev to allow me to do what I know what to do. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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