Wrong item sent. Who pays postage?

[gumpy000]

And I agree. Im not out there to ruin anyone's business. But the rude message and the morals of all this is so wrong. Lets just forget it. I know i have been right and lets hope it stops.

We both have the right items back in our hands.

 

MODS please just delete this whole thread.

[Adrian@TORQEN]

Please leave thread open, I'm on the line with the Business Support via gov.uk website clarifying Distance Selling Regulation and Consumer Act application for this particular situation.

I will post discussion here as soon as I finish.

 

 

 

[HaydnH]

Please leave thread open, I'm on the line with the Business Support via gov.uk website clarifying Distance Selling Regulation and Consumer Act application for this particular situation.

I will post discussion here as soon as I finish.

 

I'm don't want to get involved in the dispute, but to save you time on the phone, see answer 18:

 

https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/429300/bis-13-1368-consumer-contracts-information-cancellation-and-additional-payments-regulations-guidance.pdf

 

 

Also the "returning faulty goods" (faulty covers not as described items) section of the Consumer Contracts Regs (which replaced distance selling in 2014) described by Which here:

 

http://www.which.co.uk/consumer-rights/regulation/consumer-contracts-regulations

 

 

p.s: sorry.

[Adrian@TORQEN]

@Ekona - No, I did not ask for any charges / money. We shipped out the correct set of struts the same day we were notified he has received bonnet dampers instead boot dampers. It was a genuine mistake made by my colleagues in the warehouse, the SKU is very similar. James had both items in his possession the next day. I've asked him to return the original item whenever is possible. It's been claimed the cost would have been £10, hence my mention of how much it costs to send it via Royal Mail - £4.45. I obviously did not ask for any money shipping the correct item, either.

 

@gumpy000 - At no point in my replies I have been "rude" to you and it has not been in my intention to do so. I'm pretty sure you still have the conversation. However, if you feel that I've been rude to you, I apologise.

 

Now, what the Business Support says via gov.uk website:

 

 

 

The link Paul Kirtley above is referring to: http://www.lawdonut.co.uk/law/sales-and-marketing/distance-and-online-selling/distance-selling-and-marketing-faqs#DSAM15

 

Our Returns policy is here: http://www.torqen.uk/p-7-delivery-returns

 

My understanding of the above conversation is that if in the T&C says that return shipping cost is supported by the buyer, then this is the contract between the seller and the buyer.

 

I might be wrong, but will ask a solicitor as we need to make sure our policies are according to the laws and regulations.

 

If I am wrong, please accept my apologies.

[StevoD]

Could be a nice money maker this, Send out incorrect items and use t&cs to get customer to pay you money to have it returned even when they didn't want it or purchase it

 

not saying Adrian did this just for clarification, but i wonder what there is to protect regular folk from a scam

[StevoD]

@Ekona - No, I did not ask for any charges / money. We shipped out the correct set of struts the same day we were notified he has received bonnet dampers instead boot dampers. It was a genuine mistake made by my colleagues in the warehouse, the SKU is very similar. James had both items in his possession the next day. I've asked him to return the original item whenever is possible. It's been claimed the cost would have been £10, hence my mention of how much it costs to send it via Royal Mail - £4.45. I obviously did not ask for any money shipping the correct item, either.

 

@gumpy000 - At no point in my replies I have been "rude" to you and it has not been in my intention to do so. I'm pretty sure you still have the conversation. However, if you feel that I've been rude to you, I apologise.

 

Now, what the Business Support says via gov.uk website:

 

 

 

The link Paul Kirtley above is referring to: http://www.lawdonut....ing-faqs#DSAM15

 

Our Returns policy is here: http://www.torqen.uk...elivery-returns

 

My understanding of the above conversation is that if in the T&C says that return shipping cost is supported by the buyer, then this is the contract between the seller and the buyer.

 

I might be wrong, but will ask a solicitor as we need to make sure our policies are according to the laws and regulations.

 

If I am wrong, please accept my apologies.

 

but you had no contract with the customer for the part he didnt want ?

[Ekona]

DSR no longer applies, it's the CCR now.

[Adrian@TORQEN]

Looking at a few other companies out there:

 

http://www.demon-twe...elivery-returns

"Returns - Goods which prove unsuitable may be returned for refund, credit or exchange if they are returned to ourselves within 14 days of receipt. Subject to the following conditions:

- Items are returned carriage paid.

- Items are received in a resalable condition.

- Items should be returned unused in their original condition in order to secure a refund."

 

http://www.tegiwaimports.com/returns

"We offer a 14 working day returns and refund policy from the date of delivery in accordance to the DSR. You will receive the full refund to the value of the order (delivery costs not included). The parcel must be returned in brand new condition, unopened and in the original packaging. The customer must bare the delivery cost of the return of the product/order."

 

http://clarkmotorspo...ditions/58.html

"Correctly supplied goods may only be returned with the Company's express permission. In such cases, credit will be made less a 10% handling charge provided the condition of goods returned are acceptable to the Company. Unwanted goods for return must be notified to us in writing within 7 days of receipt. We reserve the right to refuse returns if notified out with this period. The cost of returning the goods safely to us is your responsibility. We may not be able to accept back non-faulty goods that have been supplied to your specific order or damaged during transit or fitting. Goods must be returned in a re-saleable condition. Some special order items correctly supplied may not be returnable depending on the manufacturer's policy on returns. "

 

That makes us all wrong, I wonder?

[Adrian@TORQEN]

Could be a nice money maker this, Send out incorrect items and use t&cs to get customer to pay you money to have it returned even when they didn't want it or purchase it

 

not saying Adrian did this just for clarification, but i wonder what there is to protect regular folk from a scam

 

Steve, how did you arrive to this logic?

 

Again, I DID NOT ASK FOR ANY MONEY, NULL, ZERO, NADA, NIHIL, NOTHING, NIENTE. Just asked for the original item to be returned to us.

Edited July 14, 2016 by Adrian@TORQEN

[StevoD]

Could be a nice money maker this, Send out incorrect items and use t&cs to get customer to pay you money to have it returned even when they didn't want it or purchase it

 

not saying Adrian did this just for clarification, but i wonder what there is to protect regular folk from a scam

 

Steve, how did you arrive to this logic?

 

Again, I DID NOT ASK FOR ANY MONEY, NULL, ZERO, NADA, NIHIL, NOTHING, NIENTE. Just asked for the original item to be returned to us.

 

i didnt say you did

[StevoD]

Looking at a few other companies out there:

 

http://www.demon-twe...elivery-returns

"Returns - Goods which prove unsuitable may be returned for refund, credit or exchange if they are returned to ourselves within 14 days of receipt. Subject to the following conditions:

- Items are returned carriage paid.

- Items are received in a resalable condition.

- Items should be returned unused in their original condition in order to secure a refund."

 

http://www.tegiwaimports.com/returns

"We offer a 14 working day returns and refund policy from the date of delivery in accordance to the DSR. You will receive the full refund to the value of the order (delivery costs not included). The parcel must be returned in brand new condition, unopened and in the original packaging. The customer must bare the delivery cost of the return of the product/order."

 

http://clarkmotorspo...ditions/58.html

"Correctly supplied goods may only be returned with the Company's express permission. In such cases, credit will be made less a 10% handling charge provided the condition of goods returned are acceptable to the Company. Unwanted goods for return must be notified to us in writing within 7 days of receipt. We reserve the right to refuse returns if notified out with this period. The cost of returning the goods safely to us is your responsibility. We may not be able to accept back non-faulty goods that have been supplied to your specific order or damaged during transit or fitting. Goods must be returned in a re-saleable condition. Some special order items correctly supplied may not be returnable depending on the manufacturer's policy on returns. "

 

That makes us all wrong, I wonder?

 

but are they not all relating to correct items being delivered in the first place?

[Ekona]

You sent the wrong item after consideration was made, which makes that a breach of contract. In theory the other guy can then sue you for any sums paid to correct this, or realistically you just refund the money or even better pay for the return postage in the first place.

 

If the guy had simply changed his mind, you would not be responsible for the cost of return delivery.

[Ekona]

http://www.which.co.uk/consumer-rights/regulation/consumer-contracts-regulations

 

Near the bottom of the page, under returning faulty goods.

[gsexr]

To be fair if your company sent out the wrong item then the customer should not be out of pocket having to return it to you.

 

The t`s and c`s you show about `carriage paid` really is aimed at the customer just deciding he does not want the part and does not really relate to a mistake made by your company.

 

Be a Decent supplier and send him a returns label for a situation caused by your company.

[Adrian@TORQEN]

http://www.which.co....cts-regulations

 

Near the bottom of the page, under returning faulty goods.

 

This says:

 

"Returning faulty goods

 

If you receive faulty goods and wish to return them, the Regulations are in addition to your other legal rights.

 

So, if your goods are faulty and don’t do what they're supposed to, or don’t match the description given, you have the same consumer rights under the Consumer Rights Act (which replaces the Sale of Goods Act from 1 October 2015) as you have when buying in store. Any terms and conditions that say you must cover the cost of returning an item wouldn’t apply where the goods being returned are faulty."

 

Dan, my understanding is that the items are not faulty, they work perfectly fine, for the sake of the argument. I'm assuming you have consumer law studies, hopefully you can clarify this, I don't. So to you, in this particular situation, where the struts were for the bonnet and not for the boot, you'd classify them under "faulty items", therefore seller should cover the return cost?

[gsexr]

Dan means this part

 

Returning faulty goods

If you receive faulty goods and wish to return them, the Regulations are in addition to your other legal rights.

So, if your goods are faulty and don’t do what they're supposed to, or don’t match the description given, you have the same consumer rights under the Consumer Rights Act (which replaces the Sale of Goods Actfrom 1 October 2015) as you have when buying in store.

Any terms and conditions that say you must cover the cost of returning an item wouldn’t apply where the goods being returned are faulty.

[Adrian@TORQEN]

To be fair if your company sent out the wrong item then the customer should not be out of pocket having to return it to you.

 

The t`s and c`s you show about `carriage paid` really is aimed at the customer just deciding he does not want the part and does not really relate to a mistake made by your company.

 

Be a Decent supplier and send him a returns label for a situation caused by your company.

 

Item is already collected and paid by ourselves via UPS. What I'm trying to establish here is the exact legal binding / terms of contract, basically who has to pay for the return of items sent out wrong and already replaced.

[gsexr]

You do because you sent out the wrong items.

 

Simple as that

[Ekona]

They do not work for the purpose which was either advertised or which the consumer asked for, hence they're faulty.

Edited July 14, 2016 by Ekona

[Adrian@TORQEN]

Alright then, my fault, case closed. I apologise in this case.

[gsexr]

[rabbitstew]

You do because you sent out the wrong items.

 

Simple as that

 

Exactly that.

[gumpy000]

At the end of the day I looked into this many times before asking you to send out a prepaid label. Yes you asked me to send the item back at my cost. You refused to send pre paid label for your mistake. It had got completely out of hand over yes £4.50 but hope this will help you for the future. I accept your apologise but this needs to be fair.

[marzman]

Way to lose a petty argument in public affecting your business.

[Andy_Muxlow]

And if the shoe was on the other foot I think you would do the same maybe Adrian?

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using hammer and chisel!

Edited July 14, 2016 by Andy_Muxlow