Av8er Posted July 10, 2013 Share Posted July 10, 2013 I'm strong enough to rub shoulders with those that are "on" and I look like I lift - but that has come from years of playing rugby, and weight training. I have patience This. Patience, dedication and hard work are the things you first need. You can drink shakes, take supplements and hit gear every day of the week. But if you don't train you won't get big. My cutting starts in 2 months - Time to feel small again 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wmr1980 Posted July 10, 2013 Share Posted July 10, 2013 Well during my time playing rugby I was a 102kg outside centre but at about 18% BF and a 36" waist I no longer play, but am at 92kg at around 14% with a 33" waist. I don't really do the bulk/cut thing as I'm not really into bodybuilding but into strength training, have done a few amateur strongman comps (lots of people on gear there though!), and generally do Olympic lifting. Most of my lifts are around squats, deadlifts, power cleans, push press, Olympic ring work, bench press, and other explosive plyometric based exercises. Good luck with the cut! I did feel scrawny for a while when you're used to being over 100kg for so long, it took me a while to get used to being "small" again. However you'll feel better and look better, especially if you're able to maintain your strength. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Av8er Posted July 10, 2013 Share Posted July 10, 2013 Ahhhh a man after my own heart, outside centre that ran 100m in 11 seconds flat, it's been a while though I did my max squat yesterday 220KG - That hurt I'm finding it difficult to decide whether I want to have size or definition... I'd love to be 100KG at about 10%BF but at 5ft 7 supporting that would be extremely difficult - I'm up at 87 as of this mornings weigh in which is a 11KG increase from my cut last October. If only fat burning and muscle building could be done at the same time hey!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stuarty Posted July 10, 2013 Author Share Posted July 10, 2013 What are you doing? Bulking or cutting? Cutting mate! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wmr1980 Posted July 10, 2013 Share Posted July 10, 2013 I knew I got a good vibe from you! Yes it's been a while since my performance down the pitch was that good, I gave up rugby owing to too many injuries and just not having the time to keep doing it at a decent competitive level. 220 squats are impressive! 20 more than my max. I'm taller at just under 6'1 so you're undoubtedly a stocky bugger compared to me! You technically *can* gain muscle and reduce adipose tissue but it is very very tough, and you need constant tweaking and monitoring of your diet and hormonal responses etc... Unless you're a pro sportsman we don't have that luxury.. Personally I prefer being slightly leaner and training and eating enough to progress rather than have to go OTT then have to cut. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stuarty Posted July 10, 2013 Author Share Posted July 10, 2013 TBH, ive always trained in TKD since i was a kid and BJJ for last 3 years. I only started lifting after an ACL reconstruction on my right knee. Anyway i'm really into my weight training now. I eat a really clean diet and the only supplements i take is protein powder to top up my Macro's and after ive lost my bodyfat i'll start taking Creatine monohydrate or ethyl ester again. I've just ordered Reflex instant whey as its low in carbs and is a blend of concentrate and isolate. I also ordered a bag of optimum health ultimate whey protein as its also a blend but a bit higher on the carbs, but not that much. I'll try both and see how i feel. http://www.discount-supplements.co.uk/sports-supplements-whey-protein-reflex-nutrition-instant-whey-2-28kg http://www.discount-supplements.co.uk/sports-supplements-whey-protein-optimum-health-ultimate-whey-protein-2-25kg Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rabbitstew Posted July 10, 2013 Share Posted July 10, 2013 (edited) Creatine is good, but it doesn't build muscle in itself. It replenishes the bodies stores and aid recovery making it easier to train harder, hence why you may feel you are gaining more. It also encourages water retention so you soon start looking bigger. Any lifters use my protein and if so whats there products like. I'm looking at their impact whey and a few other bits and bobs. Used Myprotein loads and they have always given good service and their prices were good. For protein powder itself i used to buy big sacks of the stuff in bulk. Like 25kg sacks etc.. always worked out cheaper. I used to get them from food suppliers who sell the stuff to chocolate makers and the like. I always went for the cheapest 80% protien stuff. Forget about flavoured stuff, you dont spend hours sipping it and enjoying it, i usually just down it. If you are the delicate type you can always add some milkshake powder to it to give it a bit of flavour. Edited July 10, 2013 by rabbitstew 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Av8er Posted July 10, 2013 Share Posted July 10, 2013 I knew I got a good vibe from you! Yes it's been a while since my performance down the pitch was that good, I gave up rugby owing to too many injuries and just not having the time to keep doing it at a decent competitive level. I'm taller at just under 6'1 so you're undoubtedly a stocky bugger compared to me! A dislocated shoulder paid and end to my career... And some would call it fat opposed to stocky haha What are you doing? Bulking or cutting? Cutting mate! Then just trawl the whey that they can offer, avoid the carbs. There's not really a selection of protein types in all fairness. The flavours are good, chocolate, vanilla and strawberry are what I've had so far. They all mix really well too. Only other stuff I'd suggest is hitting Thermopure and buy some creatine powder at the same time to make things a bit easier. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stuarty Posted July 10, 2013 Author Share Posted July 10, 2013 Also ordered glucosomine, works well after my knee op. anyone tried tribulus? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Briggsybriggs1 Posted July 11, 2013 Share Posted July 11, 2013 I tried tribulus liked it when first started going the gym it seemed to work staked it with zma as well. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wmr1980 Posted July 11, 2013 Share Posted July 11, 2013 To be honest trib and zma don't boost test that much certainly if you are in you 20-30s. D Aspartic Acid (DAA) is a better supplement if you're after enhancing and maintaining natural hormone levels. Still, you are dealt the hand you are given, unless you ready to go exogenous (which is pointless to me ) the best you can do is improve your diet, train hard, that alone will help enhance and improve your hormonal profile, I'm not saying that supps don't help, but until you get everything else nailed in your lifestyle then you're peeing money away. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stuarty Posted July 11, 2013 Author Share Posted July 11, 2013 (edited) After chatting with a few natural bodybuilders, ive decided to just have a really clean balanced diet. The only supplements i'm going to take is protein shakes (whey first thing in the morning, straight after workout and milk protein before bed, all with low carbs) and after i cut my body fat down, i'm going to start taking creatine. Reason why i'm waiting to start the creatine is because i want to know that any weight i put on is due to muscle growth and water from the creatine and not fat! I'm currently 14st 8lbs. Once i cut to around 13st 9lbs i'll start the creatine and if i go back up so be it. The problem ive got is i'm trying to gain loads of lean muscle but i have to stay in a certain weight range to be able to cut to just under 85kg for fights. Which will be hard considering i'm 6ft. Edited July 11, 2013 by stuarty Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stuarty Posted July 11, 2013 Author Share Posted July 11, 2013 (edited) D Edited July 11, 2013 by stuarty Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flex Posted July 11, 2013 Share Posted July 11, 2013 Good balanced diet, watching fat levels, cutting out junk and booze, plus training hard 3-4 times per week will sort that out. Keep a calories diary too, that will show you were you going wrong. I lost 2 & 1/2 stone last year on this basis. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ekona Posted July 11, 2013 Share Posted July 11, 2013 Good balanced diet, watching fat levels, cutting out junk and booze, plus training hard 3-4 times per week will sort that out. Keep a calories diary too, that will show you were you going wrong. I lost 2 & 1/2 stone last year on this basis. Could not put it better myself. Exactly what I did a couple of years back to drop 5st in 11 mths, best thing I ever did. I still have days where I binge like crazy, but as I've kept the rest of the diet and exercise up it bother me not a jot. Life is for living, and pizzas are definitely living well! Sometimes I wish I understood the whole protein shake and creatine thing a bit more, but I cannot get my head around drinking a 1000 kcal shake. Good luck to any one who goes down that route, but it's a bit too hardcore for me. As long as I can fit into normal clothes without having a belly and I've got some definition on my top half, I'm happy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flex Posted July 11, 2013 Share Posted July 11, 2013 Nice one Dan, I agree. I used to be one of those people and it's taken a long time to see that it's a fairly pointless existence training every hour of the day (slight exaggeration) and the only person that really benefits is you when you crack one out over yourself in the mirror because you look too hot. No one else really cares what you look like, unless you're fat and then they'll point it out all day long. Having said that I do still love to train legs, cant beat a nice set of quads, yum yum Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ekona Posted July 11, 2013 Share Posted July 11, 2013 the only person that really benefits is you when you crack one out over yourself in the mirror because you look too hot. Coffee --> keyboard :lol: I can't stand training my legs, feels like I never get anywhere. I like bicep workouts the most, but that's only because it's the one muscle I can really feel work when I'm finished. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Av8er Posted July 11, 2013 Share Posted July 11, 2013 After chatting with a few natural bodybuilders, ive decided to just have a really clean balanced diet. Reason why i'm waiting to start the creatine is because i want to know that any weight i put on is due to muscle growth and water from the creatine and not fat! Hey bro, do you even lift? Sorry, I was getting bored of waiting for someone to say it haha If you are cutting then you've chosen the right option - but don't be surprised if you dont lose weight for a while, I found this when I had to lose 11KG IN FAT. I was still increasing muscle mass whilst I was burning fats, so even though I lost a lb of fat, a lb of muslce was gained - this can make it disheartening as you don't see the results, but it's worth it... How long is your cycle? I do a good 4 months of cutting which make you feel really small Creatine won't cause you to gain muscles though mate, it will only aid the repair of your muscle tissue - in turn it will seem like it builds your muscle, but ultimately it's the protein which will do this for you. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ekona Posted July 11, 2013 Share Posted July 11, 2013 Can someone explain cutting and bulking to me? I kinda get that cutting is losing weight and bulking I assume is bulding muscle, but are the terms that simple? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Av8er Posted July 11, 2013 Share Posted July 11, 2013 Can someone explain cutting and bulking to me? I kinda get that cutting is losing weight and bulking I assume is bulding muscle, but are the terms that simple? In one sir! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flex Posted July 11, 2013 Share Posted July 11, 2013 Actually I think bulking is more weight in general, hitting heavy weights in the gym to gain overall mass with less attention to lean mass. Cutting is stripping away fat and leaving the lean muscle tissue. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Av8er Posted July 11, 2013 Share Posted July 11, 2013 Actually I think bulking is more weight in general, hitting heavy weights in the gym to gain overall mass with less attention to lean mass. Cutting is stripping away fat and leaving the lean muscle tissue. With bulking yes you do gain fat, but the ultimate aim is to gain muslce mass which is the leaned during the cutting phase. It's one of those things which sadly come hand in hand, to gain muscle you need an increase calorie intake, and no matter how hard you try, fat will always increase as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flex Posted July 11, 2013 Share Posted July 11, 2013 Not if you keep a strict lean diet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ekona Posted July 11, 2013 Share Posted July 11, 2013 Cool, thanks chaps Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Av8er Posted July 11, 2013 Share Posted July 11, 2013 You'd gain strength, but not neccessarily mass. Your body needs excess calories so that it can repair and grow. If you aren't providing it with enough energy to grow it will just metabolise the proteins to repair the muscle and little growth will take place. I've got 2 months of bulking left before my cut ready to move to Florida and get me some USA hunnies - I'm taking about 6000cal a day It gets addictive and is a very slippery slope - you saw me 2 months into my bulking stage I think - Now back to a 42'' chest Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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