nievelc

Those 2 questions are formidable my friend. Wonderful stuff

Did anyone see when the leave campaign made a song and dance about being part of a united states of europe and think, what's wrong with that or was that just me?

On point 1 -Jobs -Benefits -NHS Not always but i reckon a large proportion, we moved to the UK from Germany when PSA was privatized and my dad had to apply for a new job. Ended up in sunny south London. With that said, I quite like the idea of living in switzerland, basic living but a good living but they do not take immigrants except for a tiny handful and you can only buy houses in certain areas.

I think I would go as far as to say he is the english abu hamzah dressing his dark motives up in as the interest of the british population.

I doubt there will be a second referendum, i seriously do and to be honest I agree with RichF we would look like absolute fools and that would not be very English to swallow our pride now would it! I am keen to see what happens in the next few months if any good comes in terms of leadership. In any case, that racist thug Farage needs to be deported back to the north sea oil well where he crawled out of, vile specimen.

First day back at the gym!! Boom!! Going through the doors of Easy Gym in west Croydon was phenomenal. Shoulders and chest I'm not going to lie, I have lost some strength but i still had 26's above my head for 8 reps on the shoulder press (strict) 70 reps done in total. Walking unaided as well now a bit hobbly when going down stairs but no biggie. Anyone on here looking for a decent surgeon to sort out cartilage issues i fully recommend Mr Datta. Literally everyday in the spectrum of pain i've been experiencing I get a little better. Walking still causes a 6/10 on the pain scale but it's now very bearable and improving.

At least we'll have a bit of time before it's dung for dinner. (JOKE) Just caught up with this thread, pretty heated. Shame. Write to your Mp's sign petitions, do whatever, probably time to lock this thread before it's turns into a 350z civil war

"Give the likes of Baldrick the vote and we'll be back to cavorting druids, death by stoning and dung for dinner..."

Can I ask the question..Why do not you want them?

:lol: Keep it clean!

Today is vote day! Do the right thing and make a vote whichever way you perceive to be correct. Good night all

https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=10153467946496736&id=638181735 I'll just leave this here, the leave guys probably won't give it time of day to read, all research has been cited at the bottom of the article.

Jug - so - if we have more migrants, more people working, more people paying taxes the government has more money, services should be scaled up. That's our fault (UK) not the people coming to the UK And you still trust parliament to have 100% power... with Boris or Farage in the first term No thanks If migrants are taking our jobs, then bigger shame on us for having the wealth of opportunities from school age and not taking advantage of them, people are interviewed and given jobs based on skill and likeability. If your not willing to be competitive in the job you do you might as well hang up your boots.

Indeed. I'm fairly pro-immigration, but I'm certainly not up for a free for all. It's the elephant in the room, why does everyone want to come to the UK? If it is jobs then please crack on and come in, make a life here and and have a wonderful time if it is a free lunch on our tax payers money then no sir you need to have paid your dues to the system first. Free movement in out of our countries is great, if people are coming over for free health care or benefits we need to be compensated for this. My stance is the same with the parasitic inhabitants born and bread in Britain that survive on benefits on the back of tax from the UK workforce. Ship them out with the UN to give back to the countries we have taken from, any money saved should be invested into the sciences and the next generation. Rant over.

Did you notice any difference? I didnt get round to it this weekend, went fishing!

Imaging this..

That was bit harsh, sorry

I think your right, On the plus side the guests of the Jeremy Kyle show will probably have a televised apocalyptic celebration which will keep the benefits scroungers amused during the the mornings dose of super tenants. Silver linings and all..

That's a stance I had not considered before, it's a good point But my lack of trust for our government (Uni fees, over paid top end civil servants, and poor management of benefits) leaves me in despair as to the carnage they can cause.

It's almost impossible to garner any 'facts' from this either way, no matter which way you swing. For example (note I do not want to talk about this) , if you look at migration stats, who has given them, how was it worked out and where are they from (as in what organisation gave these details) ? There is typically an agenda behind even the most simple sodding thing like the above (usually just simply follow the money) and hugely differing numbers etc. There is ALWAYS some form of bias selection when it comes to this stuff that we are all guilty of, simply as it strengthens our view, you can't change that. Exactly figures can always be manipulated and sold to the audience\ consumer. But each man to their own, vote how you believe is right.

Received! I will report back on the weekend as to how much i have buggered it up

Not sure any survivors of WW2 would like that stance but each to their own - Remember they were fighting from being oppressed by a regime that tried to exterminate an entire religion and anything that did not fit their liking, if WW1/WW2 has proven anything it is that the member states need to work together to prevent War, Germany was oppressed and Hitler seemed to be the solution. Prevention is better than cure. Neither of which are in the EU and impacted by us leaving? Correct, however if you read up we slaughtered thousands in these countries in a sense we were their Nazis, my point is the UK is one of the most successful countries in the EU, we owe it to give back, Except that's not how it works. If you are in the EU you can turn up and claim all those benefits. It works both ways of course, ex-pats can do similar I'm sure. Correct again but my point again is the benefits system is the problem, not the immigration. People should be able to come to the UK to work. Depending on where you are fortunate enough to live, perhaps. There are certainly some areas worse impacted than others however. I lived in Croydon for 25 years, my gym was in west Croydon as was my local supermarket. I work in Birmingham 2/4 weeks a month, in my company I work with 2x Sri Lankan's, 1x Sweedish, 1x Slovakian, 1x African and 6x from the UK. again to reiterate my point - people that put in to the system and add to the country or transfer to further Education are what we need. Which massively depends on the field of work. A lot of the industries impacted are manual labour, farm, factory etc. Why pay minimum wage/overtime when you can pay cash in hand to someone else on the sly. "A national minimum wage" is this not because of the EU, some countries don't have it but have a bargain agreement instead from what i understand. Which we cant do being part of the EU fully, the EU commission does it on our behalf. And we would create better trade agreements because... And if we did how would this weigh up against the financial and ethical reasons to stay. On a separate note, i just took the 3.30 trip to trap 2 and caught up wit FB - It's also been an eye opener to hear peoples opinions and views, the level of racism in this country is absolutely disgusting. (I am not suggesting Sargara is one!) but it is mind blowing.

Tie his feet together and put itchy powder on his groin?

I'll be quite honest my views on the should I stay or should i go debate are simple and several posts here state fundamentally what I consider most important fact - no guarantees can be put in place in terms of policies, trade or whatever so I am taking a holistic view on the matter, with that said I choose to stay. Power I believe under no circumstance should any country should absolute power over itself, since 1951 none of the member countries have had war waged between them. People seem to think Britain will do better by itself, maybe financially after a few years that would be true but that's a narrow minded mentality. In my opinion we owe it to the rest of the world, India, Africa to name a couple to do our bit, if that means surrender £Millions to create budget for other members who are having it bad then so be it, what i do not agree with is that the other countries cannot just expect a free handout - I am looking at you Italy, Greece and Spain. Reforms for these countries need to happen to bring equilibrium to the pack but this is where the EU should be helping the phrase 'give a man a fish..' springs to mind Immigration - Healthcare My view on immigration is I am all for it - 100% open the borders to the world [i am bracing myself for a tw*at in the nuts here] Cameron hit the nail on the head when he said after only after 4 years of working in the UK you would be entitled to benefits, NHS care, the whole lot. Japan do it i believe it is 10 years there. Immigration is what has made this annoying little island more bearable. Watching guys on the Cameron vs Farage debate who's close descendants were clearly immigrants say there is an immigration problem sickens me, (I myself am an immigrant with my mum being half japanese and half italian, me being born in Scotland, raised in Germany) we do not have an immigration problem we have a problem with our benefit system. I can't watch benefits street because i get so furious watching the skyving little oiks prancing about and believing they are entitled to do so. They are the problem. Be it English, African, Martian or whatever these are the people that suffocate the budgets and take from what is most important in our civilisation - Education and Health. My personal opinion of these parasites is they should be recognised as a resource and used for overseas UK charity projects. I have a close friend who works with the UN in disaster relief and could do with some people to hand out rice. Immigration - Jobs For the argument 'They are taking our jobs' - If a position opens at my business we request CV's and have an interview process, after the applicants have been reviewed we make a decision and offer a position to the successful applicant. If you did not get the job it is because I or the team did not like your attitude or you were not up to scratch. Not because you were English. Trade This is where my opinion is grey, however the question is always "Do we get more being in or out" and i think the accurate answer from what i gather is "Probably" to both, one thing I did take from the debate which cannot be ignored is when it comes to trading with China, India, Russia, US, etc an agreement with 28 countries to 1 can certainly give us more leverage. With that said I am not money driven in any way, and have always made a measure of wealth with a few questions - 1. Do you have a house? 2. Do you have a car? 3. If the washing machine breaks can you afford to replace it without worrying? If you answer yes to all 3 then your in a good position, add some friends, good health, holiday and opportunity and you become full circle happy. So in a nutshell should we exit? No in my opinion If we cannot be trusted to sort out our own Education, Health and benefits system then why should we trust the absolute power of the UK to a single house of politicians? Would you trust absolute power to Boris or Farage? Cameron may be a pig shagging excuse of a bovril dot but I have more trust in him with the EU then the alternative solution.