coldel

Not sure what the guy means, angle? The mace is effectively representing the royalty without which the house cannot meet nor laws be passed it's fundamental to the governing right of parliament, it was a stupid thing to do - would he have ejected the Queen had she been stood there? I think he would have been branded a traitor to the country had he done that to her so this is no different.

Was Dennis Skinner drunk?

Not renegotiate the deal, to seek assurances - its different. Its about clarifying and getting something in writing from the EU on what the backstop means. Yes Sky News pointed out the pound drop... ...still no single person in the house challenging it has said how to enable a borderless Irish border outside the EU. When is someone going to actually suggest a solution to something everyone is currently shooting down.

She has just mentioned she is looking for 'assurances' so no change to the deal but some official statement from the EU around how the backstop will be implemented..?

I think she made a good statement. Corbyn's response was terrible. But its a big step back from 'this was the only deal' to what looks like going to the EU to look at the backstop. Unfortunately all I am watching right now are people looking to power grab in Westminster. Its all very shameful, and the speaker having to get people to shut up constantly is embarrassing.

The backstop is an odd one as its not an economic issue, its to ensure that in the event of a trade deal impasse that we can continue to trade freely with the EU across the Irish border. To be honest I would imagine the EU don't really care what is in the deal but whatever it is it has to ensure the Irish hard border doesn't appear. Note, from what I have read none of the critics of the deal have come up with an alternative.

Suspect TM is off to Brussels to try and rework the backstop. Thats the thing holding this deal back. To be fair its the right thing to do, but should have been done sooner, Commons defeat on this has been obvious for a while now.

We are all entitled to our opinion and respect yours, mine would be that again we reward catastrophic failure with PM position seems to rub up against every fibre of my being. DD has been proven to be unequipped to work at this high level and the gold class example of the Peter Principle - he would be a disaster leading this country. Although could imagine just with him there a lot of harder right leavers would vote for the Tories with him in charge.

Yes they should. Although rumblings are they haven't, only in the last month have they actually been looking at this. They certainly need to get the economists involved asap, given only a few countries actually operate this way with the EU like Cuba etc. theres not much in the way of knowns to work with. WTO isn't an 'easy in' it doesnt cover some services, it also doesnt allow members to vary their trade rules either unless there is consensus, so we will be in effect bound by their rules and their constituent members requirements (hard brexiteers will fail to mention this of course as it doesn't suit their rhetoric around sovereignty)

Then we do not need him for that, in fact we do not need a brexit secretary as no deal exit is a much more straightforward and quickly destructive process. DD for me is fundamental to the entire mess we are in now, he is as culpable as Cameron and anyone else. He was set a task to create an exit deal and wasted 2 years failing because he couldnt negotiate away from the fantasy land he and the JRM cronies hung onto. The guy should not be given another job, unless we believe catastrophic failure should result in reward as a way forwards. Somewhat ironically the deal on the table is a leave EU deal, fundamentally it is. The backstop is the only thing that would technical tie us to the EU and even then its an option that may or may not be introduced. By pure definition the deal does give the option to leave the EU. And lets also bear in mind not all leave voters voted for a hard no deal brexit.

I would love to know why? He was brexit secretary for 2 years and failed his remit spectacularly, made no progress, couldnt negotiate, lost time and subsequently weakened our negotiating power - given this complete failure to get a deal, I can only presume he would come in to oversee a no deal exit?

What it does do is delay the lost vote > general election direct route, which is why Jezza is out there screaming bloody murder right now. He is probably going to lose a load of cash on all those election posters he pre-paid on for delivery Weds...vote of no confidence on the way possibly?

Govt sources saying its postponed...statement at 3:30pm. Must be embarrassing for Gove who was telling everyone this morning it is on. Its like watching an episode of the 'Thick of It'

...and its still going ahead. With a further reiteration from the EU that the deal has already been negotiated and agreed. I think we might see a few bloody noses tomorrow, not only TM but also those MPs who think we can just go back to the negotiating table if MPs vote against it - alternatively, it could be that the EU are saying this to pressure MPs into voting for the deal.

Keep an eye on the news around 1pm, TM has called a conference call with senior ministers for one hour from 11:30am. Is she going to pull the vote? Or are they literally going to re-inforce the message that the deal is a hard fought one that is not going to be renegotiated (as mentioned by Irelands deputy PM this morning).

No its new, last week a leading EU law maker said the UK could possibly revoke article 50 https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-scotland-politics-46428579 clearly that was opinion only and not legally binding - this news is breaking right now that the court has officially said we can. I am sure you can imagine those against the exit deal and no deal will be holding it up in the air shouting with renewed vigour.

Well this will no doubt get people on both sides fired up... https://news.sky.com/story/european-court-of-justice-rules-uk-can-unilaterally-revoke-article-50-and-halt-brexit-11576865

Can be difficult to judge an exhaust by video clips - maybe try locate some members near you who have different set ups go along and listen. You can also get a good description of different setups speaking with the traders on here who have experience selling them over the years.

Well this week will be the telling week - EU have said no way they will renegotiate, its this or nothing and that all negotiations are done. Really it depends on what happens when its rejected in parliament, if May goes, if the no confidence vote appears, if Labour win a GE. Ultimately it is not in the EUs interest to suddenly give a load of concessions because our MPs reject the deal, otherwise as above it will embolden the more far right politics of certain EU countries. What is a shame is that the ground that the EU claim they have given up to the UK to allow us to find the deal has not been clearly cited. It would demonstrate to people how we have arrived where we have. Negotiation is not about getting your ideal scenario (so the views of Boris et al), both sides if stuck by that principle would never agree. We have probably given more ground than the EU, but of course thats the nature of negotiating with a hugely powerful bloc - I would have liked to have seen what they gave up to get to where we are - the only analysis I can find is this one https://www.reuters.com/article/us-britain-eu-concessions-factbox/factbox-where-the-eu-has-made-concessions-in-brexit-talks-idUSKCN1NL1WA To be honest, if it wasn't for the backstop, would the exit deal be such a bad one? What parts of it are people generally annoyed at that its so terrible?

Sorry chaps but most likely doing a summer break with the family if its on the 25th bank holiday as thats kids half term also. Any other weekend would have been fine.

Aint gonna happen, those German cows pretty much work for free

Ahh, I just cannot do reality tv, makes my head hurt!

Like I said up top mate, I think if it becomes no deal we will see companies frantically trying to figure it out (supermarkets have just spent a fortune buying up 6 months of storage over the last few days, expect your pint of milk in Tesco to increase in price shortly ) and we will see some change in the ways things work, it might cost more, which will be passed on to us. If the government continue to self destruct and end at no deal then they have to be in some way accountable for helping directly affected business get through next March be it in tax breaks or the like.

Could Immingham say increase by 1000% overnight? If so, I would imagine its making huge losses right now in used capacity. What about food produce, that comes from thousands of different sites all over Europe, how do you get it onto planes? I presume they are not lying idle around just waiting to go. Around 10,000 lorries pass through dover each day, are there enough planes? Is there enough airspace? Do planes have freezer and refrigeration containers? Tesco and other supermarkets do not have the distribution facilities (I work for one of the big four) people might think, more worryingly is that they do not have the storage as most supermarkets operate on a just in time business model. I would imagine if it were indeed cheaper, better, to fly stuff or use other ports then companies would do that, so you have to ask the question, why aren't they? Edit: Just looked at the routes, and Immingham is a much greater distance on water 15 hours vs 1.5 for Dover. I would imagine the costs as outlined above in terms of time on vehicle, driver, increasing return journey time by the vehicle by around 2 days all would have significant financial impact on a business operating model. When you consider most supermarkets run at between 2%-4% gross margin any costs have to be minimised, suppliers arent going to suck up any extra cost and supermarkets will pass it on.

I read articles on this today, I think most do say something like 'Dover and other ports...' open up and read the BBC article for example. Dover is a good example though and cited by news articles as when there have been problems there in the last few years with the port we have actually seen lorries parking on motorways going back miles. In terms of other ports, I would imagine you could use them but the time taken to get lorries through would still be the same as Dover and the same problems arise in terms of queuing. Then you have to consider are there enough ferries running, infrastructure at the ports etc. if you re-route traffic that way - Dover takes around 60% of all ferry traffic, how would a port that takes around 5-10% deal with 15-20% extra coming their way? I think it would depend on the industries and companies in each case - I am sure they use the Dover route because its the best route for their business, their own costs and business model will be impacted if they change this - take fresh produce for example, what happens if the driver has to add 36 hours to their journey to go to a different port, how does the quality of the food get impacted? The extra cost paying drivers, extra fuel, longer time product on vehicle cost, the lost trips that vehicle could make due to increased time on each single trip etc. I am pretty sure if we go no deal we will see all sorts of ingenious ways to try and keep things going, I can imagine its all going to cost though, and that cost is only going to end up in one place and thats at the door of the customer.