Ebized Posted March 24, 2013 Share Posted March 24, 2013 Interesting race until team orders screwed it for one team and Seb had the red baron mist and took matters into his own hands. Had to laugh though when Lewis did a Jenson and wrong pitted - loved to have seen the Maclaren team bring the lollipop down when he pulled in. Lotus must be disappointed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Bounty Bar Kid Posted March 24, 2013 Share Posted March 24, 2013 I don't accept Seb's explanation. Complete bull! Never realised that there were team orders! :@ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rothers2901 Posted March 24, 2013 Share Posted March 24, 2013 Pure arrogance on the part of Vettle. Just another example of ("I'm bigger than the team"). He was lucky not to have been punched. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AJRFulton Posted March 24, 2013 Share Posted March 24, 2013 What Vettel did today was a cheap shot and doesn't do much for his popularity. Great driver (although I don't think he's as good as his stats suggest), but comes across as a brat. For a guy that is actually quite funny and likable when interviewed away from a Grand Prix track, there is something far wrong when he is getting booed all the time. Vettel benefited massively from the final pit stops when Red Bull brought him in before Webber to cover the Mercedes. If Webber came in first he'd in all likelihood of came out 7-8 seconds ahead of Vettel, and went on to win the race on merit. However Red Bull (correctly) made the call to bring Seb in first, gaining him 4 secs on Webber, but ensuring the Mercs were never going to be a factor. What Vettel did next was disrespectful and cheap. He's stole that win today passing a guy who wasn't expecting to be racing nor had a car tuned to full spec, and a guy he only caught up with due to a team decision on pit stops. It's a completely different situation from Hamilton/Rosberg, Hamilton found himself in that predicament due to being aggressive early on, and a strategy that seen him underfueled. Harsh on Rosberg but fair play to Mercedes, and Hamilton how they handled it. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrumbMC Posted March 24, 2013 Share Posted March 24, 2013 A bitter end to what would have otherwise been a great race. Team orders ruin racing but without the teams there would be no racing. I think the Mercedes' situation was different to that of RB, Rosberg clearly had more pace than Lewis. However, Hamilton would have fought Nico for the position so from a teams point of view, unless they instructed Lewis to let Nico passed, it was either keep Nico on a leash or let them race and potentially lose points. With McLaren pulling their socks up and Lotus & force India showing good pace Mercedes need every point they can get at this early stage of the season. I think, for the team, Ross Brawn made the right decision and the drivers have shown that they respect his leadership. Poor old Webber. I don't think he will be doing Vettel any favours any more. I think this was the final straw for him and I can't see him renewing his contract with red bull after this year. Which would be a shame for RB as they have a very mature and on occasion, untouchable driver in Webber. He was obviously following team orders regarding his pace today and Vettel's move up the pit wall, which would have been spectacular in a normal racing situation, was very Schumacher-esque. People (like myself) who usually fight Vettel's corner will have lost a lot of respect for him after today. But on the other hand, it is a race, and often in the driver's championship every point matters. Sometimes you have to get your hands dirty to taste success. He said himself he isn't bothered about criticism from the media or anyone outside of the team. Shame it's three weeks till we get a grudge-match. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JetSet Posted March 24, 2013 Share Posted March 24, 2013 I've never seen three more miserable drivers on the podium today and I would imagine Rosberg in 4th was too happy either. When Vettel first arrived on the scene he was a real breath of fresh air, a young and very polite guy but with every year becomes more and more arrogant. He should take some time reflect on this and realise how much damage this has done to morale at RB, I wouldn't like to be on the flight back home with that team tonight. Mark Webber is a sort of adopted Brit, he's lived here for many years and is a pretty likeable guy so I wouldn't be at all surprised if Vettel was roundly booed at Silverstone this year. Pete Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
350 Russ Posted March 24, 2013 Share Posted March 24, 2013 I've never seen three more miserable drivers on the podium today and I would imagine Rosberg in 4th was too happy either. When Vettel first arrived on the scene he was a real breath of fresh air, a young and very polite guy but with every year becomes more and more arrogant. He should take some time reflect on this and realise how much damage this has done to morale at RB, I wouldn't like to be on the flight back home with that team tonight. Mark Webber is a sort of adopted Brit, he's lived here for many years and is a pretty likeable guy so I wouldn't be at all surprised if Vettel was roundly booed at Silverstone this year. Pete I think vettel has been getting booed at a few places recently, quite rightly too. I totally agree with everything you have said. did you see his apology? he folded his arms when he said he misunderstood what was supposed to happen. He then blinked on the word truth. Body language wasn't good. to over take your team mate after your supposed to both turn your engines down is a really cheap shot, i think his popularity amongst the pit lane will have taken a massive hit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spursmaddave Posted March 24, 2013 Share Posted March 24, 2013 Team orders suck, and saying there would be no F1 without the teams, what about the fans? Who wants to watch a race with 2 sets of 2 cars from 2 teams being told what to do How is it telling a bowler when to bowl a wide or telling a keeper to let a goal in is cheating but telling a driver not to overtake another isn't? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
glrnet Posted March 24, 2013 Share Posted March 24, 2013 The trouble is they are competing for 2 trophies, drivers and constructors and you can't throw the constructors competition out because of the sponsorship/financial implications. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spursmaddave Posted March 24, 2013 Share Posted March 24, 2013 The trouble is they are competing for 2 trophies, drivers and constructors and you can't throw the constructors competition out because of the sponsorship/financial implications. Yeah I'm far from an expert I want to enjoy it and get the bug but I just find it frustrating and manipulated... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JetSet Posted March 24, 2013 Share Posted March 24, 2013 Team orders suck Indeed Dave, I'm no great lover of team orders in F1, they do nothing for the spectacle of the sport. I can understand the need for them towards the end of the season when the fight for the championship is really on though. The problem is that when orders weren't allowed we got coded messages like "Philipe, Fernando is faster than you" . Pete Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wasso Posted March 24, 2013 Share Posted March 24, 2013 This was the first F1 GP I've watched in over 10 years only because its been naf. Agree with Graham but don't agree with why its a team rule. Same with rallying, and its a shame a driver can't drive. Seb was lucky to be alive with the block made by Webber, another 8" and there'd been an all mighty mess. To be fair I enjoyed F1 today for the first time in a loooong time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wasso Posted March 24, 2013 Share Posted March 24, 2013 (edited) Double post (forum having a right tizwas these days) Edited March 24, 2013 by Wasso Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrumbMC Posted March 24, 2013 Share Posted March 24, 2013 The cars seem to be coming home 2 by 2 a lot these days. it doesn't suprise me with the tyres this season. Driver skill come race day has little effect as they are all driving at 70%. therefore the standings seem to be in order of whoever has the best tyre management. This is why today was 2 RB, 2 mercs, ferrari (fernando probs would have finished 5th or 6th) then 2 lotuses. I think because of this we are going to see a lot of team orders in the 2013 season. Maybe I should tweet that to 'the sky pad' next week and see what they make of it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ekona Posted March 24, 2013 Share Posted March 24, 2013 I'm in two minds over this. Vettel broke team orders, and should be punished (but won't be). Mark did everything as he was told and came second. Seb has three world titles. Mark has none. You can kinda see where I'm going with this. Yes, it was stupid and irresponsible and caused a hell of a lot of problems for Christian in the coming weeks, but really it counts for very little. Mark is never going to win a WC at RB, as he's clearly the no.2 there, but at his age he has no chance of going anywhere else. Seb knows he's untouchable, as if RB p*ss him off then he'll ship off to Ferrari and earn a whole load more cash whilst still being in a competitive car. Even in the interviews, when Marko came out and said that Seb was in the wrong, Christian was very careful not to criticise the golden boy for fear of him jumping to the red team. You cannot run a team like that, and Mark was incredibly restrained post-race, far more than most drivers would've been. Imagine a Kimi or a Lewis in the same situation...? Truth is, Mark is almost as toothless as Massa. Ah yes, Lewis. I make no apologies for him being my favourite driver, and today I should've been celebrating as he got a podium in only his second race for Mercedes. And yet, it didn't particularly feel like celebrating any more than Lewis himself did. Both him and Nico showed immense respect for each other and Ross with their reactions both during and after the race, and whilst neither will sleep well tonight at least they know where they stand and can continue to work as a team. In truth, the whole situation makes me feel a little uncomfortable as an F1 fan. On the one hand I'm glad team orders are now out in the open, on the other they killed this GP. On one hand Seb was a c*nt, on the other that's exactly what you expect a WC to do. Lewis is the Merc no.1, but clearly doesn't feel he deserves that and if he doesn't believe it, then why should anyone else? I'm not sure if there's anything positive to take from any of this at all, except maybe that it was one of the greatest races and post-race that I've witnessed in recent memory. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrumbMC Posted March 25, 2013 Share Posted March 25, 2013 Yeah summed it up well there Dan. I genuinely think that the merc situation would have happened either way round but imagine how Horner and Marko would react if Vettel and Webber were in each others shoes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ebized Posted March 25, 2013 Share Posted March 25, 2013 Yeah summed it up well there Dan. I genuinely think that the merc situation would have happened either way round but imagine how Horner and Marko would react if Vettel and Webber were in each others shoes. That thought had crossed my mind and if Christian had ordered Vettel to stay behind (like Rosberg was ordered) I can't see his future would be looking too good at RB given the German ownership/funding and the thumbs down the team would get from the German public. Sadly you can't help feeling that Webber has no chance of winning a title with that team while Vettel is there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M13KYF Posted March 26, 2013 Share Posted March 26, 2013 1. I want to watch a race to the final lap 2. Why didnt RB ask Vettel to give the place back. There was ample time to do it. Then there would clearly be no confusion in the order given to Vettel and his claiming that he misunderstood. 'He didn't mean to do it' bullsh!t!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrumbMC Posted March 26, 2013 Share Posted March 26, 2013 (edited) Caption competition: Edited March 26, 2013 by CrumbMC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jumping350 Posted March 26, 2013 Share Posted March 26, 2013 I reckon what he did just shows his competitiveness,he was bold and confident to take that risk and pull it off,Webber could of taken the place back but didn't even attempt to, i know because of team but still showed me who wanted it more,also everyone moans at vettel which is fair enough but Webber knew vettel was trying to overtake so why put up so much resistance through all those corners? I suspect because he knew he couldn't get back past either way pretty poor decisions from both but RB 1-2 he overtook someone to win a race,its sport anyone at a high level would do it, except massa lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jetpilot Posted March 28, 2013 Share Posted March 28, 2013 Not a massive fan of F1 for the very reasons outlined by everyone else posts. I care not which team wins the constructors title, i want to see the best driver win, not the best team. I dont think any of us will truly know if Webber did have the pace to win, if you take what has been said as gospel that Webber turned the engine down expecting not to be challenged, then Vettels actions were an absolute disgrace. There is a very simple answer to this, no car to pit intercom, rely on the old fashioned pit board, the only info a racing driver should need is, position, lap and time splits. Or at the very least, a button to press to say you will be in for tyres next lap or vice versa from the pits to car. I also dont like the fact there is so much run off in F1, not to say it should be dangerous, but they can often make quite big mistakes with little punishment to their lap times. F1 is far to controlled and regimented imho. I wont turn this into a bike vs car discussion and although the MotoGp has been relatively boring the last few seasons with regard to on track battles, we do generally see the best rider win. Roll on some changes to let us see the best car and driver win. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Bounty Bar Kid Posted March 28, 2013 Share Posted March 28, 2013 New t shirts from piston heads... Loads of other stuff available too! http://www.shotdeadinthehead.com/catalogsearch/result/?q=multi+21 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaz 350z Posted March 28, 2013 Share Posted March 28, 2013 This made me smile.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JackStrong Posted March 28, 2013 Share Posted March 28, 2013 Have you seen on sky news that Bernie thinks vettel did the right thing, surprise surprise. Also apologies if this is a repost..lol : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2nbvqQ28-1g Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ruddles Posted March 28, 2013 Share Posted March 28, 2013 I want that t shirt!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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